¿Debe ser pública la vida íntima de los mandatarios?

WEBVTT

1
00:00:06.919 --> 00:00:13.320
I am Roberto Pombo welcome to my
questions an average rush program sponsored by KFAM,

2
00:00:13.759 --> 00:00:21.600
family compensation box. One of the
bemolls of being a person with power

3
00:00:21.719 --> 00:00:25.839
as a president is that the line
that separates his private life from his public

4
00:00:25.920 --> 00:00:30.800
life is becoming more and more diffuse. The details of the Presidents' loving

5
00:00:31.000 --> 00:00:36.960
and intimate life must be public.
A political leader can be ethical in public

6
00:00:37.439 --> 00:00:42.280
and not in private. For this
chapter we spoke with journalists Angela Patricia Janiott,

7
00:00:42.359 --> 00:00:46.439
María Elvira sanper Daniel Coronel, Ana, Cristina Restrepo, Lloranda Ruiz and

8
00:00:46.479 --> 00:00:52.119
Daniel Sanperrospina. I am Roberto Pombe
and this is chapter ninety- seven of

9
00:00:52.159 --> 00:00:57.359
my questions welcome. I' m
going to start this chapter with a confession.

10
00:00:57.719 --> 00:01:00.679
I' m a romantic man who
believes in love. This feeling I

11
00:01:00.759 --> 00:01:06.239
mean love is perhaps the one that
has motivated stories the most. Most great

12
00:01:06.239 --> 00:01:10.840
works of art have to do with
impossible loves, toxic loves, difficult loves,

13
00:01:11.079 --> 00:01:15.560
failed romances. In short, and
many of these great stories of love

14
00:01:15.799 --> 00:01:19.560
have transcended centuries and even millennia,
such as Robó and Juliet, the story

15
00:01:19.879 --> 00:01:25.079
of an impossible love that created an
archetype in itself, or the story of

16
00:01:25.239 --> 00:01:29.159
power, violence and love between Dalina
and Samson, in which the woman betrays

17
00:01:29.159 --> 00:01:33.200
the strongest man in the world who
is in love with her, revealing the

18
00:01:33.200 --> 00:01:38.879
secret of her superhuman strength. And
perhaps my favorite Colombian novel of this kind

19
00:01:40.280 --> 00:01:44.280
is the love in times of García
Márquez' s anger, a magnificent story

20
00:01:44.560 --> 00:01:49.920
about the resistance of love. Over
time, only people in love could write

21
00:01:49.959 --> 00:01:56.480
these stories. In short, it
would take hours to view all the novels,

22
00:01:56.599 --> 00:02:00.840
stories and stories that have been written
on this subject. Real life has

23
00:02:00.200 --> 00:02:05.719
also given us great love stories,
although here I must confess that those who

24
00:02:05.760 --> 00:02:09.400
mix with power are my favorite.
For example, the first one that comes

25
00:02:09.520 --> 00:02:15.319
to mind is a story that mixes
two great characters like Cleopatra and Julius Caesar,

26
00:02:15.680 --> 00:02:19.439
in a relationship that still gives much
to speak to historians, or that

27
00:02:19.439 --> 00:02:23.400
of Napoleon Bonaparte, one of the
most important military and politicians in history,

28
00:02:23.199 --> 00:02:28.360
who fell in love with Josefina de
Bornet, a lady of French high society,

29
00:02:28.479 --> 00:02:31.759
and her relationship was full of infidelities
due to Napoleon' s long absences,

30
00:02:32.319 --> 00:02:38.479
but her relationship ended because she could
not conceive reiter. I' d

31
00:02:38.680 --> 00:02:44.840
have to spend hours reciting the number
of stories around love. But in my

32
00:02:44.919 --> 00:02:49.479
personal capacity, one of the ones
that has interested me the most is the

33
00:02:49.840 --> 00:02:53.360
one that supposedly existed between the President
of the United States, John Fischer and

34
00:02:53.400 --> 00:02:55.479
Kennedy, and the actress and model
Marilyn Monroe. Of this reliable information,

35
00:02:55.960 --> 00:03:00.400
but rumors have been that Monroe has
an affair not only with President Kennedy,

36
00:03:00.560 --> 00:03:07.919
but with his brother, Attorney General
Robert Kennedy. These rumors were fueled in

37
00:03:07.960 --> 00:03:13.439
part by the sensual happy birthday performance
for President Kennedy of the celebration of his

38
00:03:13.680 --> 00:03:16.960
forty- five birthday at the Mison
Square Garden on 19 May of one thousand

39
00:03:17.000 --> 00:03:22.280
nine hundred and sixty- two months
before the death of Hollywood' s son

40
00:03:22.360 --> 00:03:53.759
hed Re. Tales of biographers escorts
and key masters suggest that Monroe' s

41
00:03:53.800 --> 00:03:59.080
alleged suicide is related to the care
of keeping the secret of r n r

42
00:03:59.159 --> 00:04:02.159
r N or of the President of
the United States. Let the world know

43
00:04:02.199 --> 00:04:06.719
that John F. Kennedy was an
adulterous person, he would have had serious

44
00:04:06.719 --> 00:04:11.759
political repercussions. As we already know, all the protagonists of this story ended

45
00:04:11.800 --> 00:04:16.680
tragically. The intimate life of people
with power, like presidents, is a

46
00:04:16.800 --> 00:04:21.839
subject that causes morbidness and curiosity.
Maybe that' s why there' s

47
00:04:23.000 --> 00:04:27.319
always so much care and suspicion about
them. This is the case that is

48
00:04:27.439 --> 00:04:30.360
the most common and controversial, that
of the former president of the United States,

49
00:04:30.680 --> 00:04:34.160
Bill Clinton and the former White House
practitioner, Monica le Whinskys, in

50
00:04:34.720 --> 00:04:39.240
case she doesn' t remember it
or is very young, never found out.

51
00:04:40.040 --> 00:04:44.000
In a thousand nine hundred and ninety- eight, a scandal broke out

52
00:04:44.160 --> 00:04:47.800
in which then President Clinton had an
affair with the twenty- two- year

53
00:04:48.600 --> 00:04:54.600
- old practitioner Monica le WINSKIY in
August of that year, President Clinton agreed

54
00:04:54.959 --> 00:04:57.800
to have an inappropriate physical relationship with
Lewinsky. The West Not of Pro IRA

55
00:04:57.920 --> 00:05:02.879
' s Sociel Wood Nestownscrit program,
the West Rold Coutts Personal fact, Faler

56
00:05:03.839 --> 00:05:12.680
ol Myport for wit iamy the PLATE
the RESPONDSB. However, in January of

57
00:05:12.720 --> 00:05:15.519
that same year, the President had
refused to have relations with her, whom

58
00:05:15.839 --> 00:05:23.800
he asked to lie about Ader Not
Health Sexual, I have wsonso of Romans

59
00:05:23.920 --> 00:05:30.839
lowanskiy ah nevir Town BND bats or
an hour santle T in Neville was because

60
00:05:30.920 --> 00:05:34.920
of this lie that President Clinton became
the second President in the history of the

61
00:05:35.000 --> 00:05:40.319
United States to be called to a
political trial, although he was then turned

62
00:05:40.319 --> 00:05:44.399
over and only had to pay$
90, 000 for giving false testimony.

63
00:05:45.519 --> 00:05:48.480
The cases in which the love,
sexual or intimate life of the Presidents becomes

64
00:05:48.519 --> 00:05:54.360
news have been several in the world. Just to mention a few are the

65
00:05:54.600 --> 00:05:58.759
cases of the former President of France, Nicolas Sarcosin, and what began as

66
00:05:58.920 --> 00:06:02.319
an affair with Carla Bruni' s
singer, when she had recently divorced his

67
00:06:02.360 --> 00:06:08.680
wife for eleven years. But before
that was Francois Holande, who came to

68
00:06:08.759 --> 00:06:13.920
the presidency as a couple of the
journalist Valerie Triballe, with whom she ended

69
00:06:14.040 --> 00:06:17.040
up admitting that she had a thread
with actress Juli Galle. At this time,

70
00:06:17.160 --> 00:06:20.759
the French press jumped on the news
and the fact was very visible and

71
00:06:20.800 --> 00:06:26.079
commented For several weeks. The public
was flooded by media coverage from all angles

72
00:06:26.279 --> 00:06:31.199
and Holland' s approval rate was
affected by this scandal. As several polls

73
00:06:31.279 --> 00:06:36.839
showed. The list of leaders involved
in gossip and living and loving is long.

74
00:06:38.279 --> 00:06:43.240
Only the Presidents of France, who
have maintained individual romances make up more

75
00:06:43.319 --> 00:06:46.160
than half. Maybe that' s
why they call their capital the City of

76
00:06:46.160 --> 00:06:50.560
Love. But beyond gossip and gossip
magazines, these rarely transcend, among other

77
00:06:50.639 --> 00:06:56.120
things, because for the French private
life is much more sacred than it is,

78
00:06:56.519 --> 00:06:59.600
for example, for public figures and
in the other United States, In

79
00:06:59.600 --> 00:07:06.319
what cases the romantic life of a
president is relevant to public opinion. He

80
00:07:06.439 --> 00:07:10.839
transferred the question to the journalist and
Joranda Ruiz, and this answered me.

81
00:07:12.439 --> 00:07:15.120
The right to privacy of public figures, particularly those in senior positions of the

82
00:07:15.199 --> 00:07:19.519
State, is not a full right
and has restrictions. In fact, this

83
00:07:19.560 --> 00:07:25.040
is reflected in several of the codes
of ethics of many media outlets around the

84
00:07:25.120 --> 00:07:29.240
world. Now it is not written
in stone, in terms of journalistic ethics,

85
00:07:29.519 --> 00:07:31.600
in which case matters of that private
life can be aired or not.

86
00:07:31.759 --> 00:07:34.959
There are differences, for example,
between what happens in a private venue or

87
00:07:35.000 --> 00:07:39.839
in a public space, but it
always depends on the situation, the context

88
00:07:39.839 --> 00:07:43.720
and, above all, the possible
public consequences of the private episode. Affective

89
00:07:43.800 --> 00:07:47.680
relations belong in principle to the private
sphere, but if they can have an

90
00:07:48.000 --> 00:07:50.639
impact on security, on the use
of public money, on the fulfilment of

91
00:07:50.639 --> 00:07:56.680
the duties of the public character,
they cease to be exclusively private matter and

92
00:07:56.759 --> 00:08:00.639
may become part of matters of general
or collective interest. On the other hand,

93
00:08:00.839 --> 00:08:03.439
we cannot forget that, although it
was long considered that the public and

94
00:08:03.519 --> 00:08:09.519
private spheres could not be crossed and
there was a kind of permanent veil on

95
00:08:09.560 --> 00:08:13.639
the considered personal matters, since today
it is clear that the way couples,

96
00:08:13.240 --> 00:08:16.480
family relationships or care work are handled, to mention some private matters, because

97
00:08:16.920 --> 00:08:22.839
today this is part of important debates
on, for example, gender roles and

98
00:08:22.839 --> 00:08:28.120
the challenges that society must face.
That is why every detail of the matter

99
00:08:28.160 --> 00:08:33.000
must always be looked at with magnifying
glass to understand when other private individuals can

100
00:08:33.039 --> 00:08:35.919
transcend and become facts that go beyond
the personal, this when speaking, of

101
00:08:37.000 --> 00:08:41.240
course, of persons who occupy high
positions in the State. A few weeks

102
00:08:41.559 --> 00:08:46.440
ago a video appeared on social networks
in which President Gustavo Pedro was supposedly seen

103
00:08:46.559 --> 00:08:50.919
walking hand in hand with a woman
in the historic center of Panama, during

104
00:08:50.919 --> 00:08:58.120
an official visit by the President.
The controversy was served. However, only

105
00:08:58.559 --> 00:09:03.240
some media took the issue as news. It was the same President Petro,

106
00:09:03.679 --> 00:09:07.879
who referred to the subject and in
his x account published a message in which

107
00:09:07.919 --> 00:09:11.279
he neither confirmed nor denied that it
was he who appeared in the video.

108
00:09:11.960 --> 00:09:18.039
The President asked for respect for his
privacy. He rejected the transphobic messages that

109
00:09:18.120 --> 00:09:20.879
came at the root of the rumor
that the woman with whom he allegedly appeared

110
00:09:20.960 --> 00:09:26.919
in the video was a trans woman
The President said Auro Comillas. I have

111
00:09:26.000 --> 00:09:31.000
always considered intimacy to be the ultimate
reason for freedom, the last trench of

112
00:09:31.120 --> 00:09:35.639
being free, and I will retain
this principle until I write of myself or

113
00:09:35.720 --> 00:09:41.799
die for those thousands of transphobic messages
that have exploded in the hands of a

114
00:09:41.799 --> 00:09:46.559
deeply exclusionary, ignorant and discriminatory right- wing society, must be rejected by

115
00:09:46.559 --> 00:09:50.679
the President. Every progressive knows that
human beings are equal and that the struggle

116
00:09:50.720 --> 00:09:54.759
for such equality involves physical and mental
emancipation and, therefore, no one who

117
00:09:56.200 --> 00:10:00.519
considers himself human can generalize the trans
in weak minds, slavery and discrimination.

118
00:10:03.639 --> 00:10:07.480
That action does not express animality,
but brutality. That' s why they

119
00:10:07.519 --> 00:10:11.320
kill the different and for millions.
That' s why they existed and there

120
00:10:11.320 --> 00:10:15.320
are Nazis. I am straight,
but you will never hear or read from

121
00:10:15.679 --> 00:10:18.919
me a transphoic word, because I
would not just stop being a man,

122
00:10:18.919 --> 00:10:22.120
but a human. I' m
closing Jomillas. The subject didn' t

123
00:10:22.159 --> 00:10:26.720
have much excitement, but a week
after empty chair and his lie detector did

124
00:10:26.759 --> 00:10:31.919
an analysis of the video. He
consulted sources on the site and, according

125
00:10:31.000 --> 00:10:35.240
to his investigations, it is President
Peto, who appears in the video.

126
00:10:35.200 --> 00:10:39.840
According to this media, he consulted
with the House of Nariño, which neither

127
00:10:39.919 --> 00:10:43.200
denied nor confirmed that it was the
President. Faced with the question asked in

128
00:10:43.279 --> 00:10:48.240
two of July, they replied that
Palacio does not take positions on personal matters

129
00:10:48.279 --> 00:10:52.159
and that he addressed quotation marks.
No staff member is authorized to comment.

130
00:10:54.320 --> 00:10:58.399
I close quotes according to the empty
chair. There are several direct testimonies from

131
00:10:58.440 --> 00:11:01.480
people who came or President Petro walking
hand in hand with the woman, they

132
00:11:03.120 --> 00:11:07.080
also found that it was not an
altered video or created by artificial intelligence.

133
00:11:07.559 --> 00:11:11.200
But beyond the fact that, in
fact, the video is true that,

134
00:11:11.360 --> 00:11:13.840
in fact, President Petro walked hand
in hand with a woman in the historic

135
00:11:13.919 --> 00:11:18.320
center of Panama, because this is
news and deserves to be covered I looked

136
00:11:18.399 --> 00:11:26.440
for journalist Angela Patricia Janiot to answer
this question. The private life of a

137
00:11:26.519 --> 00:11:33.600
public official or of a president should
not be of importance and should not generate

138
00:11:33.720 --> 00:11:39.240
general scrutiny unless there are some eventualities, for example, when private life goes

139
00:11:39.399 --> 00:11:46.440
into public light, moving from private
space to public space. How was the

140
00:11:46.480 --> 00:11:50.519
case with the scandal video in Panama. This generates, of course, the

141
00:11:50.600 --> 00:11:56.039
curiosity of the public, the journalistic
interest and generates several questions. For example,

142
00:11:56.240 --> 00:12:01.720
the video is real, authentic or
a fake video generated with artificial intelligence.

143
00:12:03.320 --> 00:12:07.360
President Petro is the person who appears
in the images, who is the

144
00:12:07.559 --> 00:12:11.399
woman who accompanies him? Well,
President Petro has not denied or confirmed the

145
00:12:11.600 --> 00:12:16.279
veracity of this video, which is
already eloquent, nor has he denied or

146
00:12:16.360 --> 00:12:24.000
confirmed the versions that identified his companion
as a transsexual woman. Another eventuality is

147
00:12:24.120 --> 00:12:31.080
whether the President' s private agenda, Petro' s private life, is

148
00:12:31.320 --> 00:12:35.519
affecting his public agenda, his official
agenda and, of course, this in

149
00:12:35.600 --> 00:12:41.080
the case of Gustavo Petro has a
background, because it is already known that

150
00:12:41.279 --> 00:12:46.799
the President cancels his presence at some
events in which he is already confirmed or

151
00:12:46.919 --> 00:12:52.320
on several occasions, has arrived late
at these events without giving more explanations,

152
00:12:52.279 --> 00:12:56.600
because he has private matters to fulfill. We should all be interested in that.

153
00:12:56.879 --> 00:13:01.200
And there is a third possibility,
and that is that if public money

154
00:13:01.720 --> 00:13:05.519
is committed in that private agenda,
that must also generate, of course,

155
00:13:05.840 --> 00:13:13.360
ethical questioning and, because it generates
a problem of conflict of interest. I

156
00:13:13.480 --> 00:13:16.039
also looked for the peléodista, the
Cristina retrepo to ask the same question and

157
00:13:16.320 --> 00:13:22.440
this is an answer. The first
consideration is whether other Presidents of Colombia have

158
00:13:22.480 --> 00:13:26.759
been screened equally their potentials or possible
extramarital affairs. And the answer is no,

159
00:13:26.879 --> 00:13:30.840
even though we have known that there
is. That' s the first

160
00:13:30.840 --> 00:13:33.480
thing. Secondly, the intimate life
of a President is not relevant to public

161
00:13:33.639 --> 00:13:39.679
opinion unless he is first using public
resources, secondly, if he is affecting

162
00:13:39.879 --> 00:13:43.879
the security of the country or,
thirdly, if the President is violating his

163
00:13:43.960 --> 00:13:46.639
oath to the Constitution and the laws
which, for that does not seem to

164
00:13:46.720 --> 00:13:50.279
be the case. A third point
and that seems to me the most interesting

165
00:13:50.360 --> 00:13:56.440
thing here is because a President like
Gustavo Petro allowed him to be held by

166
00:13:56.559 --> 00:14:00.200
the hand with a woman who is
not his wife, because Gusto state,

167
00:14:00.519 --> 00:14:03.840
but was in a public place,
in a city full of journalists, i

168
00:14:03.919 --> 00:14:05.399
e, knew that they would see
him. And then, like nobody else,

169
00:14:05.960 --> 00:14:09.200
as in the mainstream media, they
didn' t make a fuss,

170
00:14:09.320 --> 00:14:13.799
he came out on the X-
Net with an ambiguous message, supporting the

171
00:14:15.039 --> 00:14:18.360
trans community and declaring then without any
need to be heterosexual. That for me

172
00:14:18.440 --> 00:14:22.799
is the question we should ask ourselves
here now is that we are not asking

173
00:14:22.919 --> 00:14:26.480
the right questions. First is why
you let yourself be seen? Why wasn

174
00:14:26.480 --> 00:14:28.360
' t he hiding? Why did
you show yourself? Why And the other

175
00:14:28.480 --> 00:14:33.799
question already journalism is why if Petro, President Petro, has so many times

176
00:14:35.039 --> 00:14:39.200
missed events or arrives late or does
not show up, why is it chosen

177
00:14:39.360 --> 00:14:45.159
when the President goes out with a
trans woman like the moment when he wants

178
00:14:45.240 --> 00:14:48.879
to do fac check and the step- by- step scrutiny of what he

179
00:14:48.039 --> 00:14:52.399
did. Why it wasn' t
done before in any of his dozens of

180
00:14:52.480 --> 00:14:56.720
previous defaults. And now, yes, that' s the kind of journalism

181
00:14:56.799 --> 00:15:01.080
we want to do. This is
not the first time that the intimate life

182
00:15:01.159 --> 00:15:05.919
of a President of Colombia has become
news. We have already discussed this in

183
00:15:07.039 --> 00:15:11.000
chapter five. For example, as
President Ivan, Duke on social media,

184
00:15:11.080 --> 00:15:15.519
rumor spread that his head of gabinetic
Maria Paula Correa was his lover. Like

185
00:15:15.639 --> 00:15:18.480
all gossip, there was never evidence
that that was true. Nor were there

186
00:15:18.519 --> 00:15:24.360
any official pronouncements in this regard.
The media also did not give it importance

187
00:15:24.559 --> 00:15:28.720
and no news was recorded about it. Only in his book, the latest

188
00:15:28.799 --> 00:15:33.679
anti- memorial line of a chief
of staff, published this year, Correa

189
00:15:33.759 --> 00:15:37.240
dedicated a space to this topic.
The chief of staff told Bro Comillas,

190
00:15:37.679 --> 00:15:41.399
" I want to talk head-
on and say that just because I'

191
00:15:41.480 --> 00:15:45.080
m a young woman and because of
the position I have to be the president

192
00:15:45.080 --> 00:15:48.639
' s maid" They don'
t think I' m capable and I

193
00:15:48.639 --> 00:15:50.799
have the capabilities to do it.
I close Comillas, But, as I

194
00:15:50.960 --> 00:15:54.039
said, beyond the mockery and trend
on social networks, the issue did not

195
00:15:54.200 --> 00:16:00.000
transcend as news in any medium.
The debate about the life of the public

196
00:16:00.120 --> 00:16:03.000
and the presidents and people with high
positions of power is old and is both

197
00:16:03.320 --> 00:16:08.279
long and wide. Much has been
written and debated about it. One of

198
00:16:08.360 --> 00:16:12.600
those many analyses is that of Nercathal, an academic at George Stown University,

199
00:16:14.039 --> 00:16:18.360
who in the year 2, 000
wrote the document The Public and Private Lives

200
00:16:18.440 --> 00:16:22.759
of the Presidents, in which he
reflects on this separation. Among other things,

201
00:16:23.080 --> 00:16:27.320
Kaital concludes that the distinction between the
intimate and public life of a President

202
00:16:27.399 --> 00:16:33.120
or President is not fully valid because
of the unique nature of the Presidency,

203
00:16:33.480 --> 00:16:37.600
which is in office 24 hours a
day every day of the week, and

204
00:16:37.600 --> 00:16:42.519
further argues that this special constitutional status
exerts prices on the distinction between the public

205
00:16:42.639 --> 00:16:47.879
and the private and that the Presidents
have only a limited reservation of secrecy to

206
00:16:48.000 --> 00:16:52.399
appeal to. And one argument that
comes up when you talk about this issue

207
00:16:52.519 --> 00:16:57.720
is that everyone, including public figures, has the right to privacy. But

208
00:16:57.759 --> 00:17:03.759
when a person enters public life,
he must understand certain issues that could be

209
00:17:03.840 --> 00:17:10.440
considered private for a private individual can
become matters of reasonable public interest. When

210
00:17:10.559 --> 00:17:15.759
that individual is running for a position, become a public servant, significant to

211
00:17:15.839 --> 00:17:19.480
put the public interest to its own. In an article published in Harvard Politics

212
00:17:19.599 --> 00:17:25.640
Review of that university, it reflects
on the pros and cons of publicizing the

213
00:17:25.880 --> 00:17:30.279
private life of politicians. On the
one hand, almost everyone rationally agrees that

214
00:17:30.359 --> 00:17:34.559
gossip about the private life of public
figures should never be the focus of media

215
00:17:34.599 --> 00:17:37.920
attention, but at the same time, there is an almost implicit expectation that

216
00:17:37.920 --> 00:17:45.279
public figures should act as a model
of that behavior. But one of the

217
00:17:45.359 --> 00:17:51.039
most important points that this article touches
is the difference between the reaction of the

218
00:17:51.160 --> 00:17:56.839
public in different countries to the behavior
of their presidents. And he cites as

219
00:17:56.160 --> 00:18:00.599
an example the case of the former
Prime Minister of Italy, Silvio de Rusconic,

220
00:18:00.079 --> 00:18:06.000
who had several sexual scandals involving sex
workers, and yet this did not

221
00:18:06.119 --> 00:18:10.440
result in a political trial for that
issue, while in countries like the United

222
00:18:10.480 --> 00:18:14.200
States, these events, such as
Clinton' s or more recently Trump'

223
00:18:14.200 --> 00:18:17.839
s, are scandals to which they
are devoted a lot of time and ink.

224
00:18:18.759 --> 00:18:22.960
According to the Harvard Political Review,
this may be due to religious differences.

225
00:18:23.519 --> 00:18:27.720
While it was adultery, it can
be considered a scandal in a Christian

226
00:18:27.759 --> 00:18:33.599
country or any country with a monogamous
majority. It can be perfectly tolerated in

227
00:18:33.680 --> 00:18:37.119
countries with a non-élite,
ruling and polygamous population. An example of

228
00:18:37.240 --> 00:18:41.960
this is that in the United States, Democratic Congressman Anthony Winner resigned, after

229
00:18:41.240 --> 00:18:45.839
it was known that he was sent
photoshile, I was stripped of several women.

230
00:18:45.960 --> 00:18:51.359
Several years later he was charged and
sentenced for doing the same with minors.

231
00:18:52.680 --> 00:18:55.720
And, on the other hand,
the French learned at the funeral of

232
00:18:55.799 --> 00:19:00.039
the former Fraste Amitrant, who had
a second secret family and also benefit from

233
00:19:00.119 --> 00:19:06.039
public funds. About the ethical behavior
of a ruler in his intimate life.

234
00:19:06.279 --> 00:19:10.359
There are also many questions and many
positions. One of them is that if

235
00:19:10.480 --> 00:19:14.759
a politician behaves badly in private matters, he could act in the same way

236
00:19:15.000 --> 00:19:18.759
with his public duties. Then,
under this hypothesis, if a president is

237
00:19:18.880 --> 00:19:22.480
unfaithful to his wife, he is
a person who cannot be trusted, because

238
00:19:22.680 --> 00:19:27.759
he is not ethical. This discussion
is broad and interesting, and Joudi Nutler

239
00:19:27.880 --> 00:19:33.759
and Miriam Schurman, politicians at the
Marcula Center for Applied Ethics at the University

240
00:19:33.839 --> 00:19:37.759
of Santa Clara, wrote an essay
on the subject. According to Nadler and

241
00:19:37.759 --> 00:19:41.640
Shulman, deep down, this question
is a form of a long- standing

242
00:19:41.720 --> 00:19:47.640
equian debate about what is called the
unity of virtues. For many of the

243
00:19:47.720 --> 00:19:52.000
ancient Greek philosophers, a person could
not possess one of the cardinal virtues virulence

244
00:19:52.200 --> 00:19:57.359
that in iron courage of justice without
possessing them all. Then, from this

245
00:19:57.480 --> 00:20:02.519
point of view, how to be
able would be a person who cannot control

246
00:20:02.799 --> 00:20:07.000
his appetites or it is intemperate to
be just or prudent. Socrates, for

247
00:20:07.079 --> 00:20:11.079
example, believed that virtue depended on
understanding. Then, when a person understands

248
00:20:11.160 --> 00:20:15.319
good and evil, he will act
prudently, tempered, courageously and righteously.

249
00:20:17.720 --> 00:20:22.519
Many people believe in this which Socrates
proposed about the unity of virtues. So

250
00:20:22.680 --> 00:20:25.960
in general, it is believed that
a politician who cheats on his wife is

251
00:20:26.240 --> 00:20:30.240
not worthy of trust in public affairs. To this we must add that one

252
00:20:30.359 --> 00:20:36.519
of the main functions of the public
sphere is considered educational and that it must

253
00:20:36.680 --> 00:20:41.279
help to form the souls of the
next generation in order to achieve knowledge and

254
00:20:41.279 --> 00:20:45.400
to act correctly. In this context, a public servant should be an example

255
00:20:45.480 --> 00:20:49.599
of good conduct. However, if
anything has taught us political history, it

256
00:20:49.960 --> 00:20:53.880
is that to be President, Prime
Minister or Emperor does not require the unity

257
00:20:53.920 --> 00:21:00.319
of virtues. Moreover, it requires
many virtues. I stay then it is

258
00:21:00.400 --> 00:21:03.400
with doubt that a politician can be
ethical in public if he is not in

259
00:21:03.480 --> 00:21:10.200
his private life. This was answered
by journalist Daniel Coronel. I believe that

260
00:21:10.400 --> 00:21:15.160
private ethics cannot be deduced from public
ethics. However, I believe that if

261
00:21:15.240 --> 00:21:22.000
there is a limit between what is
public and researchable in anyone even public men

262
00:21:22.079 --> 00:21:26.720
there is a margin of private life
that must be respected. This does not

263
00:21:26.799 --> 00:21:30.319
mean that there may be a dichotomy
between what they do in public and what

264
00:21:30.400 --> 00:21:36.119
they do in private, but only
what affects their public performance can be investigated

265
00:21:36.200 --> 00:21:38.799
and published. And this, then, is not something that goes in line

266
00:21:40.000 --> 00:21:42.480
with many cultures. For example,
in the United States, he recalls the

267
00:21:44.039 --> 00:21:48.559
scandal of the Democratic candidate for the
presidency, Gerry Hart, who fell for

268
00:21:48.599 --> 00:21:51.319
having a lover. Possibly that wouldn' t have been a point of inquiry.

269
00:21:51.400 --> 00:21:56.039
In Colombia, where we have a
different culture and where candidate heads of

270
00:21:56.359 --> 00:22:02.480
state have enjoyed a respect and prudence, let us say great press towards their

271
00:22:02.799 --> 00:22:07.640
public activity. But in general,
ethics is an area. The private and

272
00:22:07.680 --> 00:22:12.160
the public. For many other people, the line between the personal and the

273
00:22:12.240 --> 00:22:17.400
public is sharp and they delay it
in a slightly different place. On the

274
00:22:17.480 --> 00:22:22.000
one hand, if in his personal
life the President misuses public resources, i

275
00:22:22.319 --> 00:22:26.000
e, if, by mere chance, the President is a fanatic of howkey

276
00:22:26.039 --> 00:22:29.640
on ice and with public resources,
Canada is followed every weekend to have matches

277
00:22:29.759 --> 00:22:34.359
of this sport on the presidential plane. Another line that divides these two worlds,

278
00:22:34.799 --> 00:22:38.920
the intimate and the public, is
the one that defines whether a private

279
00:22:40.119 --> 00:22:42.920
matter affects the performance of the duties
of the official, in this case,

280
00:22:44.119 --> 00:22:47.839
ceases to be a matter of his
intimate sphere and becomes of public interest.

281
00:22:48.799 --> 00:22:52.119
In this sense, physical and mental
health is important information for the public.

282
00:22:53.440 --> 00:22:59.200
Thus, diseases that affect the work
performance of local officials can be topics of

283
00:22:59.279 --> 00:23:04.640
mesmerizing research. The same is true
of behaviors that could impede the performance of

284
00:23:04.680 --> 00:23:10.039
a president, such as substance abuse, which should be a matter of public

285
00:23:10.079 --> 00:23:15.400
interest. Financial problems, especially in
a person with budgetary responsibilities, may also

286
00:23:15.480 --> 00:23:21.319
be relevant. In many cases,
the mental health of several presidents around the

287
00:23:21.400 --> 00:23:25.920
world has served as an argument by
their opponents to criticize him. We have

288
00:23:25.960 --> 00:23:30.720
seen this in a number of cases, but more recently with candidate President Joe

289
00:23:30.720 --> 00:23:33.920
Biden, whom even his co-
partisans have asked to be part of the

290
00:23:34.119 --> 00:23:38.640
campaign for several lax who make doubt
his mental service. In fact, there

291
00:23:38.799 --> 00:23:42.720
has always been a rumor of former
president and Virgilio Barco began suffering from Alzheimer

292
00:23:42.759 --> 00:23:47.839
' s even during his term of
office, and that is why his mutism

293
00:23:47.880 --> 00:23:53.039
and strange behavior must be public or
deprived of the mental and physical health of

294
00:23:53.079 --> 00:23:59.119
the Presidents. I asked the question
to journalist Maria Elvira Samper and this she

295
00:23:59.200 --> 00:24:03.799
told me to answer must take into
account a frame of reference. First,

296
00:24:03.920 --> 00:24:08.759
that the citizenry has the right to
sound relevant information about its rulers, Second,

297
00:24:10.160 --> 00:24:12.200
that the rulers have the right to
their private life and, third,

298
00:24:12.519 --> 00:24:17.279
that those rights are not absolute.
Thus, in this context, the private

299
00:24:17.400 --> 00:24:22.000
mastery of the Presidents is reduced and
information about their health, both mental and

300
00:24:22.079 --> 00:24:26.480
physical, is of public interest because
it can affect or interfere with their functions.

301
00:24:26.680 --> 00:24:29.799
Now, I' m not a
psychologist, I' m not a

302
00:24:29.839 --> 00:24:33.599
psychiatrist either, but I' d
say mental health is more than the absence

303
00:24:33.599 --> 00:24:36.400
of mental disorders. I think it
also has to do with states with a

304
00:24:36.480 --> 00:24:38.680
high degree of distress, stress or
anxiety, memory loss, mental lapses,

305
00:24:40.160 --> 00:24:45.440
confusion, difficulties in communicating and disorientation, also with addictions, emotional compulsion,

306
00:24:45.319 --> 00:24:51.440
impulsiveness, narcissism, proclivity to lies
and lack of empathy. The catalogue is

307
00:24:51.519 --> 00:24:55.359
broad, and both the President and
former President Trump, who was in the

308
00:24:55.440 --> 00:25:00.200
White House and aspires to repeat,
fit some of these categories, but they

309
00:25:00.200 --> 00:25:03.799
are very much wondering why this matter
is important, and the answer is that

310
00:25:04.200 --> 00:25:08.400
the Twenty- Fifth Amendment to the
United States Constitution says that, if the

311
00:25:08.480 --> 00:25:14.640
President is considered to be quotation marks
unable to exercise the rights and obligations of

312
00:25:14.759 --> 00:25:19.039
his office I close quotes, the
Vice President must take his place. Another

313
00:25:19.359 --> 00:25:23.400
aspect that has caused debate is the
consumption of substances. For example, if

314
00:25:23.480 --> 00:25:30.960
a President smokes cigarettes he must often
be public knowledge. You should have the

315
00:25:30.039 --> 00:25:33.559
citizenship to know if a president smokes
marijuana at night or if he takes a

316
00:25:33.599 --> 00:25:37.440
couple of glasses of whiskey every day. On the one hand, one might

317
00:25:37.720 --> 00:25:41.160
say that if the consumption of substances
affects their decisions, it must be reviewed.

318
00:25:41.440 --> 00:25:45.519
I mean he decides the education budget
with a couple of suits and liquor

319
00:25:45.559 --> 00:25:49.599
on his head or under the effects
of marijuana is good or bad that decision

320
00:25:49.680 --> 00:25:56.079
he made. Perhaps there is moralism
in the discussion and many people will claim

321
00:25:56.160 --> 00:25:59.519
that it is not the same to
have a glass of whiskey as to smoke

322
00:25:59.519 --> 00:26:03.400
a marijuana cigarette. Other people will
say that the important thing is that the

323
00:26:03.519 --> 00:26:06.960
use is not problematic and does not
affect the mental abilities of the President.

324
00:26:07.160 --> 00:26:11.960
A President must be abstemious in every
way. What' s the limit.

325
00:26:11.759 --> 00:26:15.759
The question is transferred to journalist Daniel
San Pedro Espino Let' s hear what

326
00:26:18.319 --> 00:26:21.480
he told me good. I imagine
anyone would think that there are trades that

327
00:26:21.559 --> 00:26:25.519
demand to be a hundred percent obstetric. I don' t know a surgeon

328
00:26:25.559 --> 00:26:27.519
can' t operate with a couple
of whiskeys on his head, for example,

329
00:26:27.720 --> 00:26:30.440
or a pilot can' t answer
for a flight after taking tequila.

330
00:26:32.319 --> 00:26:34.839
In the case of a President,
it should therefore be similar. Unless it

331
00:26:36.039 --> 00:26:40.240
is clear President of Circombia, the
truth is that our country circus, several

332
00:26:40.279 --> 00:26:45.279
presidents have endured the tragedy of driving
the ship steeping elbow, seems like a

333
00:26:45.279 --> 00:26:52.519
country driven by drunks that we do. The rulers should be abstract is the

334
00:26:52.559 --> 00:26:56.640
truth. By contrast, that'
s for those of us who have to

335
00:26:56.640 --> 00:27:04.079
endure them. Empires have been shaken
and governments have fallen due to the private

336
00:27:04.160 --> 00:27:10.640
indiscretion of their rulers. But also
world leaders must have committed acts that many

337
00:27:10.759 --> 00:27:15.319
would consider unethical or reprehensible, and
yet they have had good results and done

338
00:27:15.480 --> 00:27:21.559
good things for their people. The
public should worry about the private life of

339
00:27:21.599 --> 00:27:29.759
a leader or should focus only on
public actions that directly impact governance. Unfortunately,

340
00:27:30.079 --> 00:27:33.559
there does not seem to be a
definitive answer. The answer is most

341
00:27:33.640 --> 00:27:37.960
likely to be yes to both questions
To a certain extent, this chapter,

342
00:27:38.240 --> 00:27:42.319
honoring the name of the program,
leaves me with more concerns than certainties.

343
00:27:44.079 --> 00:27:47.680
I don' t think there'
s a universal answer. It will depend

344
00:27:47.880 --> 00:27:52.079
on each case whether certain aspects of
a president' s intimate life should be

345
00:27:52.079 --> 00:27:56.839
made public. They almost always speak
louder about their actions and results in the

346
00:27:56.160 --> 00:28:02.079
power of gossip and details of their
private life. I am Roberto Bom and

347
00:28:02.119 --> 00:28:06.039
this was chapter ninety- seven of
my questions. See you on the next

348
00:28:06.119 --> 00:28:11.000
road From now on, this chapter
of my questions is available on all podcast

349
00:28:11.119 --> 00:28:19.079
platforms. This episode was made possible
by Kafan. Family compensation box. Dirección

350
00:28:19.319 --> 00:28:25.720
Roberto Pombo, Producción General Juan Abel
Gutiérrez, Asesor editorial, Daniel San Pedro

351
00:28:25.799 --> 00:28:30.640
Espina, Guiones juan Abel Gutiérrez y
Johnny Rodríguez. Field production Marcela Salazar and

352
00:28:30.799 --> 00:28:34.279
Lucía Beltrán. Post- production of
audio Carlos Bernar